Weltschmerz (German: [ˈvɛltʃmɛɐ̯ts] ⓘ; literally “world-pain”) is a literary concept describing the feeling experienced by an individual who believes that reality can never satisfy the expectations of the mind,[1][2] resulting in “a mood of weariness or sadness about life arising from the acute awareness of evil and suffering”.
as per Wikipedia.
This thought just crossed my mind. Many artist which are renowned for their art and their depth of it have a story of pain behind it (e.g. Van Gogh, Beethoven, Hemmingway). If they would have used antidepressants (or not suffered physically) would they still have created their artworks they are known for?
(The question came to my mind because I feel sensitive to (at least percieved) injustice and recently it feels the world got worse in that regard. I am thinking about getting therapy (in addition to therapy and an autism diagnosis). Assuming I’d get antideperessants and also assuming I wasn’t too fucking burned out to have at least one creative hobby and also assuming the antidepressants reduce my “Weltschmerz” (and other issues) - would that potentially make me a worse artist as I can’t channel this part of me into my works?)
There was a comedian who did a bit about how she got stopped after a show and told “If you take antidepressants your art will suffer! We wouldn’t have gotten The Sunflowers if Van Gogh was medicated!” to which she pointed out that we only got The Sunflowers because Van Gogh was medicated. He was taking foxglove, an herbal remedy for depression at the time, which has the side effect of making you experience the color yellow a little too intensely.
It will definitely be different. It won’t be worse, though.
Looking at Trent Reznor’s life and career I don’t think it’s ethical for me to tell you the answer man
I had a doctor explain to me that normally antidepressants help you heal and function.
But in my case my problems are very real and anyone would be severely depressed with my problems.
I tried them anyways, really improved my quality of sleep mostly but it also made it easier to piss me off. Overall they only did well to rescue me from extreme despair.
I think they are valuable tools and I wish access to them was ubiquitous to those in need.
Here’s a thought experiment you might find worth pondering:
Assume, for this experiment, that becoming more mentally healthy definitely leads to being less artistic. You still make art, but it isn’t as good or profound as before.
Given that premise, would you forgo happiness for the sake of your art? Would you recommend others do the same? If you could offer Van Gogh advice, would you tell him to avoid help and embrace suffering so that he could produce nice paintings?
No. You are creating in spite of your depression, not because of it.
You might become drawn to different subjects or style, but it’s horseshit that depression and misery causes you to make ‘good’ art.
I think it might change your art, but let me explain why I don’t think it’s that bad: whenever you change your habits, you will notice a difference to your mood and day-to-day headspace.
Antidepressants also change your habits, and thus they change what you think about, when you can be creative, and how you create.
I used to be scared that I would “lose the spark” over time when my habits changed drastically or when I took breaks from my craft, and I still am, but I can tell you in 8 years I’ve always bounced back and I still do some cool things and other people like some of the things I do. It definitely changed, but I know I learn and grow and thus my experiences necessarily change anyway, and so change in inevitable. BUT: for now it hasn’t stopped me - sometimes I just need a little bit of a push.
Honestly just see what it’s like and don’t get scared when your habits and thoughts change. Try to adapt to it and switch up your workflow if it absolutely won’t work. And don’t forget: you can always add restraints to kick-start your process. Best of luck and may your future art be beautiful as well:)
Thank you for this reply.
don’t get scared when your habits and thoughts change.
I guess that is the quiet part of the question out loud, isn’t it?
This gives me some hope for my future. Currently I don’t see a spark for me to lose, so only upwards from here.
I certainly will try as I found a low I did not existed and the trajectory hasn’t been great for years, so something needs to change.
you can always add restraints to kick-start your process.
Though what do you mean by this? I seem to have trouble understanding.
Sometimes it’s hard to start a new art project. Creative restraint can be really helpful. Example: starting a song with only live recorded samples, or painting a picture with only 5 colors, or writing something from the perspective of an animal.
Sorry, for your challenge, I hope real science, not pharmaceuticals, find the answer for you & all others challenges that do not help, their are ones like my own I would never want cured.
I am no way a expert doctor in this field & doubt you will find one hear, you should find one IRW. With that being said, I do not trust hugely profitable pharmaceuticals industries “solutions”. Especially in The USA, & even more so now. Side effects are often less bad then the challenge, even if it is not they can horrible & still not worth it. I watched a ‘Free Speech’ show called ‘Rising Up with Sonali’ episode where a person suffering from serve depression was having bad trouble with pharmaceutical solutions, so he dived into research & found pharmaceutical solutions do not work at for depression & advised against it. I hear LSD & such illegal in The USA drugs, works because they rewire the brain, as you safely, under supervision of a foreign countries’ experts, go through the experience, after take the drugs, that are legally available for such practices in countries extremely close to us. Plus, they have no side effects,
I too would not take such pharmaceuticals, because yes more problems are created/side effects are added to the challenges, in most cases do not even solve the challenges. Oh yeah pharmaceuticals are a lot more expensive & take longer, if they are going to work at all.
Plus there are none drugs & pharmaceuticals solutions you could research, talk to a expert & try.It’s different for everyone. You shouldn’t be afraid to try pharmaceuticals, but also know they may not work and may have side effects. Personally, I found SSRI’s to work for my depression and I know other people that they didn’t help. Also, my prescription is $1 for a month supply, so not necessarily expensive either - it depends on the drug and where you live. You should talk to a doctor to be sure.
You sound like one their commercials, may have side effects, seriously!
By the way, when I say research & then talk to an expert, I do not mean just a doctor or just any doctors. They have been proven to bought- off by the corporations that sell the drugs.
I personally didn’t experience any, but I know others that have. I’m just trying to be responsible when advocating for people being open minded about mental health treatment. Would you rather that I lie and say there are no side effects?
I don’t trust doctors either, but they do know more about medicine and health than most people on earth, so they can still be a useful resource.
I hear, but lets us be real we do not know of any pharmaceutical that does not have side effects, & those advising have horrible side effects, many times worse than what people are suffering from.
Biggest possible asterisk possible in this Capitalist World is when these doctors are taking stuff (like money, luxurious trips with pharmaceutical corporations employees) from pharmaceutical industry or actually own pharmaceutical coorporations, if not then they are trustworthy. Then question because how the heck do you know either way? Gov.? Pharmaceutical industry is one the biggest lobbyist.
I am being real. Sometimes the side effects are bad. If they are, then don’t take the drug. This isn’t as complicated as you are making it. Like doctors might be paid off to push a drug, but if they’re prescribing generics, then that’s probably not the case. Just have to use common sense when listening to doctors . You can’t take everything they say at face value, but that doesn’t mean doctors are useless.
Taking antidepressants does not have to reduce your creativity. Artists express their experience with their art. Sometimes it does it so well that people observing the art (through the lens of their conditioning) get moved. More damatic emotions get noticed more. But art can capture subtler experiences too. Antidepressants won’t remove your capacity to experience, it just changes the quality of the experience. Pay attention to all the qualities of your experience and you’ll notice it’s not just the intense ones that have vibrancy. You can convey that in art beautifully as well.
The suffering artist is a known trope but don’t think it’s a prophecy.
Thank your for your insight💕
More damatic emotions get noticed more. But art can capture subtler experiences too.
Of course, ‘everyone can be artist’. But wouldn’t the lack of the dramatic lead to a lesser chance of ‘making it big’?
(Not that I have the desire or the skills to do that - I mean if I could spontaneously choose a super skill it would probably painting - just to probably mostly draw furry porn /jk unless)
Pay attention to all the qualities of your experience and you’ll notice it’s not just the intense ones that have vibrancy.
I will, once I get my brain in order. I am having a hard time recalling positive experiences right now, especially ones that are “vibrant” in any way. But I think that is the depression.
(In my opinion everyone should try their hand at a creative hobby, no matter if classic or unconventional, and I am trying to find smething that ‘sparks joy’ but its hard right now.)
Of course, ‘everyone can be artist’. But wouldn’t the lack of the dramatic lead to a lesser chance of ‘making it big’?
Depends, because you’re not going to be conveying your experience perfectly anyway. It first goes through your own interpretative lens to the art, and then the art goes through the viewer’s lens. Big and dramatic emotions are easier… yes and as such may be more predictably marketable. But it’s a fickle business. Of course this is a concern only if marketability is how you measure “making it big”. We have a lot of art these days that’s easy to get into… and easy to drop. If you want world to remember you (Gogh wasn’t appreciated until after his death), you can try to convey something deeper and more complex.
I am having a hard time recalling positive experiences right now, especially ones that are “vibrant” in any way.
There’s vibrancy in deepest depression and the most boring line in the blandest grocery store. That’s for an artist to discover. But I’m not saying you should or should not take meds. But depression tends to lead to bad outcomes, and the world is full of depressed artists who didn’t make it.
Thank you for this perspective. I will try to adapt some of it for me. I do not intend to become depressed artist.
Welcome. I recommend you check out this book: https://adyashanti.opengatesangha.org/store/publications/books/falling-into-grace-535 (don’t let the title get in the way, it’s more Zen Buddhist). I imagine you can find it from a library.
It was helpful for me during some really rough times.
Man I feel this. I sometimes think about how if everything was relatively better it would still not be good enough. Its like it might be more tolerable but still so much bad.
Absolutely not! I have always found that my creative output has been at its best when I’m at my most mentally healthy.
I hope that I discover the same for me
